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Current Comments:
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23rd of October 2014 04:26 PM by Ron Riches
I must apologise Webmaster for straying into non-HCGS territory. I was tempted and found wanting when an opportunity arose to continue a line of tongue-in-the-cheek semi-political banter with my brother-in-law who I have sadly not seen for a number of years.

Equally tongue-in-cheek was my speculation regarding the designation to houses although during my 1944/49 time and my brother's 1937/42, Kent (my house) and Windsor (that of my brother) seemed more sportingly challenged than random selection might have achieved. More sour grapes I hear you mutter!

Your memory serves you better than does mine David G. I can't remember the actual ceremony of selection but the evidence upon which the captains were elected must have been a bit tenuous after such a short period.
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23rd of October 2014 03:27 PM by Bill Green
Firstly can I add my thanks for the very interesting sports stats provided by David Morris and added by the Webmaster. At first glance I have not been able to discern any bias to one or other of the four houses but perhaps others may show some Machiavellian influences at the point of allocation.

Regarding the Webmasters Post 940, I did not open the website in time and " ..removal of the last two posts.." had occurred. In general I have much enjoyed keeping up to date with the views expressed about HCGSB and would not advocate any significant change but a bit of controversy I believe makes the exchanges more interesting, providing always nothing of a libellous nature is allowed.
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23rd of October 2014 03:04 PM by Webmaster
Webmaster has been looking out for an email from you D.G. to answer the request for a phone number but have not received anything to date. Please email so that we can ascertain where the problem lies.
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23rd of October 2014 02:40 PM by David Gregory
Message for David Morris. Many thanks for posting sports stats. I tried to make contact but Webmaster would not accept either of my two addresses. Thanks again.
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23rd of October 2014 02:27 PM by David Gregory
Ron. Your comments regarding House selection are interesting but vary from what I recall. It was a wet and windy September day in 1944 that "Tabby" gathered all of the new first form pupils together in the centre circle of the main football pitch after our very first game of football. He then selected four "Star" players and called out their names Don Bates, Don Payne, Alan Rawlings, and a chap called Buckland. They were then named as house captains, but from memory I don't believe Houses had been nominated. The house captains were then asked to pick, one at a time, who they would like to join them. This was reminiscent of being at the Regent Dance Hall while Sid Dean said the next dance was a Ladies Excuse me. Talk about feeling like wallflower. I did eventually get selected to join Alan Rawlings. I cannot recall how we advanced to the next stage of House selection, maybe someone can enlighten me. Ron, you were there and presumably suffered the same fate. Also I cannot recall "Basher", with fag in mouth, lurking in the near vicinity.
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23rd of October 2014 01:19 PM by Webmaster
Many thanks for the approbation which is presumably directed at me rather than the somewhat opinionated BobK , whoever he may be. When I started the site as an advert for the "70years on"
reunion I had no idea how "organic" a little space in the world wide web could be. I have always tried to keep the site strictly as a depository and forum for things Hove Grammar School and with the help and advice of Geoff Stoner have been reasonably successful in this respect. That is why, reluctantly, I have to remove the last two posts . I have toyed with the idea of having an open forum which would be entered by password and would have to include disclaimers etc. but by definition it would thereby be diluted and pointless . Please help with this dilemma and let us have your views - as succinctly as possible please.
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23rd of October 2014 01:03 PM by David Langley
I simply do not understand the following:

"the period spent in education is governed by the rate at which natural development is related to the ability to absorb knowledge and therefore remains virtually constant".

Bill Lawrence would not have been impressed..

In any case, knowledge and education are not synonymous.

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23rd of October 2014 12:33 PM by Ron Riches
I am sure that creating a website is considerably easier than it appears to people like myself to whom the mysteries of such technology are totally beyond comprehension but that cannot alter the fact that this particular website is as good as it gets. As we approach the magic thousand posts I feel constrained not only to congratulate Bob K on its outstanding success but to thank him for the hours of undiluted pleasure that the site has given me.

The new addition of "sports statistics" is not only interesting but it serves to strengthen my long held suspicion that the designation of house places might not have been entirely a matter of chance. Throughout my time at the school, York and Gloucester always seemed to vie for the honours whilst Windsor and Kent fought over the wooden spoon. Whenever I asked Don Bates if his and that of his pal Dilley Chapman's entry into York house was in any way influenced by the fact that his father Basher was responsible for all of the school's physical activities his normally benign demeanour was completely transformed. Makes you think, doesn't it?
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22nd of October 2014 11:35 PM by Webmaster
Thanks to David Morris for sending the relevant 1957 School Magazine pages.
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22nd of October 2014 04:53 PM by Robin Phelps
One of the reasons that I raised the subject of school hours was to confirm my thoughts that there have been no reductions of times within secondary education in the past 60 years whereas there have been quite large reductions in the adult working week together with greater holiday entitlements.
However, judging by the experiences of my grandchildren, sixth form college hours seem totally random and do not appear to be efficient or cost effective.
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22nd of October 2014 01:01 PM by Peter Ballantine
School times changed in my time there(58-65) we ended up with 5 lessons in the morning; school started i think at 8.55 and finished for lunch at 1pm and only two lessons in the afternoon and we finished at 3.45 unless it was a cricket afternoon when we went on until 4.30
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22nd of October 2014 07:48 AM by Ron Riches
I think that I remember Ken Nash David but I wouldn't put my pension on it. The lad I'm thinking of had ginger or at least gingerish hair and was a train boy I think from Hassocks. I believe that he joined the Hove police force but I'm far from sure on that score.

You're a cheeky blighter Bob P. I'll be reporting you to your big sister!
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21st of October 2014 09:24 PM by David Gregory
Ron, I am unable to contradict the information you have given regarding school working times. Afraid the old memory doesn't stretch that far. However I can confirm some exciting news in that the bell which signalled the end of each lesson was rung by a young lad named Ken Nash who was in our year and presumably was the only chap in the school who had a reasonably reliable watch. He was also a more than capable goalkeeper for Kent House. Strange how the memory retains the unimportant facts in life and loses those which are more significant!. You will probably remember him.
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21st of October 2014 09:06 PM by Robin Phelps
Many thanks Ron. The doctor asked me to pose the questions to you and I am pleased to report that he his more than happy with your memory. Bob P
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21st of October 2014 07:18 PM by Ron Riches
Sorry, I forgot. I have no idea of the girls schedule except that the commuters among them caught the 8.00 from Haywards Heath in the morning and shared with us the infamous 4.28 home.
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21st of October 2014 07:14 PM by Ron Riches
Crikey Bob P, I've had eleven more years than you to forget such statistics. As I remember the day started at 9.00am and finished at 3.50pm to allow a leisurely stroll to Aldrington Halt for the 4.14 to Brighton. I believe that we were obliged to endure seven forty minute lessons amounting to 280 minutes. There being two sittings for dinner the overall break I think was one hour and forty minutes and there was a further smoke break of twenty minutes between two of the morning lessons which if my highly fragile arithmetic is correct would allow twenty-four minutes to take in assembly and getting set up for the first lesson.

I will now wait to be shot down in flames. However, whilst the arithmetic may be dodgy, I will only accept correction regarding the schedule from David Gregory, my only fellow 1944/49 subscriber to this site as there were no doubt a few changes over the ensuing years.
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21st of October 2014 03:04 PM by Robin Phelps
Ron, in the absence of any other contributors, can I ask you to remind me as to the start and finish times of the school day at HGSB? Also, the times and durations of the intervening breaks?
Did the girls school have different hours?
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20th of October 2014 09:02 AM by Ron Riches
Where's everybody gone? Was it something I've said?
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15th of October 2014 09:29 AM by Ron Riches
Oh that I could have been that subtle Bob.
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14th of October 2014 08:04 PM by David Langley
I seem to recall Peter Watson enrolling me in the Peace Pledge Union. This was a feat of consummate salesmanship because I was "all for" the RAF when my mind was in charge.

On joining MoD there was some slight hassle regarding my lunge at youthful pacifism, which cropped up from time to time as I rose hesitantly and slowly in the hierarch,y and was vetted to higher and higher clearance.

[At one such vetting I was asked what I considered to be deviant sex. "Anything I wouldn't attempt!" Not the answer required, apparently].

Answers on a postcard to the Webmaster please.
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14th of October 2014 05:54 PM by Bill Brock
Ignoring distinguished alumni for the moment, does anyone know what became of Peter Watson (c. 1947-54)? We, his contemporaries, thought him an eccentric genius. I recall him electioneering in the playground when the school held mock elections (Scruff Romer's idea I think). Later, in the VI Form he wrote several impressive verse dramas on classical subjects in T. S. Eliot style. These were produced by the Quartet Players in local venues that included the Pavillion Thetare in Brighton. The others in the cast were Kenneth Morris, Chris Knight and Gillian Conway from the Girls' School. They were supported intellectually and financially by Bill Lawrence. Watson read English at Oxford where he became sports editor for Cherwell. He's last mentioned in a school magazine in 1956. One would have expected great things from him, but there's no record of him on the web.
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14th of October 2014 04:34 PM by David Morris
Message for David Gregory

Would you please forward your telephone number to the Webmaster through the website system so that I can give you a call regarding the source of your football and cricket stats?
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14th of October 2014 12:13 PM by Bob Kennett
Spot on Ron.
Mad ? Freudian slip?
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14th of October 2014 11:40 AM by David Gregory
A second senior moment. For Bill read David.
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14th of October 2014 11:35 AM by Ron Riches
I wonder Bob, if in the case of BGS with their longer history, traditions had developed that led to a bias in favour of certain professions whereas, at least when I started at Hove in 1944, the school was only seven years old and such traditions had not had long enough to take hold.

A different situation may however arisen in respect of the train boys I believe that in 1937 Hove opened its doors to 300 pupils and by 1944 this number had increased to around 500. Assuming that the number continued to increase and bearing in mind that in 1944 all train boys were accommodated at HCGS, perhaps boys began to be syphoned off to BGS but by what criteria selection was mad, I can offer no suggestion.
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14th of October 2014 11:33 AM by David Gregory
Re my previous post 915 for Bill Morris. Afraid I had a senior moment and got the dates wrong. I intended to say Football '48-49 and Cricket '49. Re career paths, I had no guidance of any type from the school. My father wanted me to go into engineering but I chose to follow a career as a Surveyor. Three years as a regular in the Royal Air Force ended that and after demob I worked for the same company for 41.1/2 years in, guess what? - Engineering.
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14th of October 2014 11:22 AM by David Morris
Message for David Gregory

Unfortunately the anniversary edition didn't include individual year's results. However I do have a possible contact who may be able to obtain them for me. More to follow. Incidentally, the stats were not scrambled when I activated the "Submit Comment" button.

The anniversary edition included the Hopkins Shield results and individual overall tables against each school played for football and cricket. I have sent copies to the webmaster who will see if they can be added to the gallery.
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14th of October 2014 10:43 AM by Bob Kennett
Ron - I wasn't suggesting that there was a deliberate process of selection from 11 y/o just that the school(s) seemed to me to have had a bias towards certain career options that were ultimately followed and presumably offered to pupils as "Careers" guidance and nothing I have seen here so far has indicated otherwise. Personally I never had any careers advice from school at all and selected my path in life by going to the library and reading a book entitled Careers. The point about catchment areas really supports my notion - HGSB & BGS have more or less the same catchment area. I lived on a council estate and my Dad was a milkroundsman so Bill's family career "pathing" was hardly relevant in my case but I do have a lot to thank the system and the school for . As for teachers - to be honest I do not remember being particularly enthused by any teachers - yes I have fonder memories of some but that's about it but then there weren't any rock stars teaching at the school and that was all I thought about as I struggled through A levels.
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14th of October 2014 10:01 AM by Bill Green
Far from shooting you down - I agree and would suggest that home environment is more important than catchment area variations. The son of, for example a skilled carpenter is more likely to pick up on those skills, which with luck in getting an interested, capable teacher recognising this potential will develop those abilities into related professions such as design, carving, sculpture etc. Don't we all have memories of school staff who made a big impression on us during our time at HCGSB and which has contributed to how we have earned a living - Tabby and Bill Lawrence were such in my case.
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14th of October 2014 09:48 AM by Ron Riches
I know!! For there read their.
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14th of October 2014 09:46 AM by Ron Riches
I'm finding it hard to believe that eleven year olds were assessed during the latter years of their primary education in respect of there suitability for any particular career and placed in the secondary school deemed to be most suited to their supposed needs. That sounds more akin to a procedure that might be adopted by the current regime in China and surely consultation with parents would be essential before such a decision was made.

I'm more inclined to think that if more pupils from either school pursued any particular career than the other the reason is more likely to be related to differences in emphasis placed upon moulding the end product. Alternatively, career choice may to some extent be related to different environments to be found in either schools' catchment area.

Well, there's a start Bob you can all now start shooting me down.

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13th of October 2014 09:45 PM by David Gregory
Very Interesting set of stats from David Morris. Would be interested to know if your Anniversary School Magazine contains any results for the '47-'48 school football first X1 and the '48 school cricket first X1.
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13th of October 2014 07:09 PM by Bob Kennett
Well - that was a merry round! But what about the original observation about the difference between the resulting careers of the two sets of school leavers ?
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13th of October 2014 04:36 PM by Ron Riches
Consider yourself b'll'cked Bob P
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13th of October 2014 04:28 PM by Ron Riches
Lighten up David! It was all intended as good natured banter. Wasn't it??
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13th of October 2014 04:22 PM by David Langley
Many thanks to David Morris for the stats. Even more thanks for the results!

Regarding #896.
It was intended as banter. In general, participants on this site keep matters pretty straight and narrow, and, in my opinion, a little levity is permissible.
I am sorry my that jesting was taken as pedantry, and recommend that the matter be closed, as being of little further interest.
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13th of October 2014 02:18 PM by Robin Phelps
Sorry. I have now found the question mark missing from my previous posting.
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13th of October 2014 02:15 PM by Robin Phelps
Excuse me Mr Riches, Sir, but isn't " young Phelps minor " slightly iffy under your regime.
Will now await further b*ll*cking.
Phelps junior.
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13th of October 2014 11:00 AM by Bill Green
But Ron your lamentable scenario could surprisingly happen, in which case the transgressor must be asked what he did it for.

Statistics can't lie, so David M has convincingly proved the superiority point of HCGSB over their Dyke Road rivals on the sports field.
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13th of October 2014 10:20 AM by David Morris
Fortunately I have retained the 1957 Anniversary Edition of the school magazine which contains the school's games records against our adversaries from, presumably, 1936. The school played 14 cricket matches against BGS of which 7 were won, 2 drawn and 5 lost. (In 1960 it seems there was no 1st eleven match but the 2nd eleven were thrashed by 147-9 to 39!!). Only Varndean and Worthing had the better record among the ten schools that we played against. Generally the school were successful against the Old Boys and Staff.

Our footballers, from all three teams, won most of their matches against our opposition apart from Varndean who won 18 matches to our 10 with 2 drawn at 1st XI level.

Overall the summary of results was as follows

Football 1st Team- Played 276 Won 159 Drew 30 Lost 87 For 1122 goals Against 735 goals
2nd Team 274 158 28 88 1257 716
U14 244 153 20 70 1195 605

Cricket 1st Team 211 106 42 62 Tied 1
2nd Team 162 93 18 51 0
U14 187 125 8 53 1

More matches won than lost !
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13th of October 2014 09:36 AM by Ron Riches
I say young Phelps minor!! What a pity I didn't have the opportunity to warn you that all submissions to this site are subjected to the most rigorous scrutiny and anything as outrageous as an omitted "s" is regarded as a most serious violation of the English language. Next thing you will be starting a sentence with a conjunction or even splitting an infinitive.

How sad is that?
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12th of October 2014 09:35 PM by Bill Green
I have a similar recollection David G of the quartered shirts their football side played in. Ours were mid-blue and white. Who supplied and laundered the school team shirts - my mind is a blank on this. I think we each had to provide our House soccer shirts, maroon for York, yellow for Windsor, dark blue for Kent and green for Gloucester, but it is unlikely we would have had to buy the blue and white ones?

I have no memory of the relative prowess on the sports field of the two schools but the School Magazine dated October 1956, a copy of which is in my possession records the following cricket result:-

May 26 Away School 84 Brighton G.S 87 for 6 Lost

I was playing in this game, but have no recollection of the ground or details, although I remain convinced it was a flash in the pan, unlikely to be repeated by the green blazers!
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12th of October 2014 02:53 PM by David Gregory
I can recall our playing Brighton Grammar at football in the mid 40's. If memory serves me correctly it was on one of their sloping pitches adjacent to the Old Shoreham Road. It would be nice to report that we defeated them by a large margin but in truth I can't recall the scores. I believe they played in dark blue and green quarters. And yes I must have played against them at cricket and our team included the late Don Bates who had an illustrious 18 year career with Sussex CCC. With all this local rivalry going on the only fact I am certain of is that our school dinners were better than theirs.
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12th of October 2014 12:38 PM by Bill Green
We did play the green blazer lot at cricket, and maybe at soccer. During my time in the school cricket team our efforts to win were always made more difficult by their star batsman, a certain Richard Langridge, son of the England cricketer James Langridge and nephew of John Langridge who appears frequently in lists of the best batsmen never to be selected for England.
Sadly Richard, who went on to play regularly for the Sussex County 1st Eleven, died a few years ago.
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12th of October 2014 12:22 PM by Bill Green
I was lucky enough to be placed in Bill Lawrence's English class, and he taught us a strict adherence to correct spelling and emphasised the importance of academic learning of grammar and punctuation. Some of you may have experienced equally impressive English teachers at school, but I suspect this doctrinaire approach was initiated by the aforementioned pipe-smoking Bill.
Some argue that on average we draw opinions about others within the first five seconds of meeting them. I have held an equivalent belief that misspelling may produce a similar negative effect.
If you get it wrong in business life the result could be detrimental, if you get in wrong among friends, accept the banter with goodwill!
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12th of October 2014 12:15 PM by David Langley
Did we ever play the green blazer lot at sport? I have no recollection whatever. Perhaps they performed rugger? But they must have played cricket. Boxing? Swimming?

But then I was never good enough to represent the school at anything other than chess.
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12th of October 2014 10:50 AM by Robin Phelps
Ron, I am pleased to say that it wasn't you that "rattled my cage". It will be interesting to see if you are rebuked for continuing the debate regarding the the standing of the two schools.
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12th of October 2014 09:27 AM by Ron Riches
What a pleasant surprise it was to find that I have rattled the cage of my brother-in-law Robin. Rest assured, you would never get under my thick skin by joining the debate on the thorny subject of BGS, after all, without a diversity of opinions there would be no debate.

Nearly half a century start enabled BGS to establish what might be called a pseudo public school image in something of a Wackford Squeers tradition and perhaps the boarders were simply the victims of Victorian travel shortcomings. Nevertheless, the rivalry was on the whole friendly and to my knowledge it never exceeded good natured banter.

Of course, it all came to an end when that arch con-man of British politics Harold Wilson, removed his pipe from his mouth long enough to announce the arrival of comprehensive education. Now there's an opportunity to start another debate!

Rest assured Robin, I was delighted to read your contributions and look forward to further gems.
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11th of October 2014 03:56 PM by Robin Phelps
Thank goodness I escaped from pedants when I transferred to the newly opened Haywards Heath Grammar School in 1958.